James Coventry: Site manager at AGL's Liddell Power Station

Thanks for joining me on the NTP’s Engineering Success podcast. Today I am joined by James Coventry who is from AGL. James is currently the site manager at the Liddell site.

Thank you very much for having me. James, I’d love, I guess for you to share a bit about your current role. If you could give us a bit of a rundown of what you do.

I suppose I start back at the beginning with a career point of view. It certainly wasn’t a career that I was looking to go into in the power industry. I was very focused on a military career and my father and uncle decided to start their own business within the power industry looking at precipitators and draft plants.

So I was employee number one. I suppose it just sort of grew from there. Started as a laborer until I really understood boilermaking.

And in 2007 I was fortunate enough to get a role leaving my father’s business with SSE and working at Ferrybridge Power Station which was sort of the real insight of that other side of the contracting world. From there went through a few engineering qualifications, assistant coal manager before moving out to Australia. We’ve been in Australia now nearly 11 years.

Western Australia first before moving across to AGL as the maintenance manager. A role which was an interesting period and one where the challenges of a 48 year old power station keeping it running was quite prominent. And then into the site transition team as the site manager.

So I suppose my role now is the closure manager at Liddell. So looking at the decommissioning, the demolition, the rehabilitation part of closure, which is extremely exciting, extremely challenging and as it seems at the moment, very, very rewarding. Yeah, so many facets to the role it is and it’s for agl.

It’s a very new process. It will be the largest coal fired power station to close in the southern hemisphere. Has its challenges but again I think AGL’s really set the team up well to deliver this and, and this is part of AGL’s commitment to greenhouse gases and close in a timely and very conscious manner.

And I guess it’s people often think of the energy industry and people may be coming from an electrical background and perhaps not a, you know, ballermaker background. Are there many people in the industry that have followed a similar path to yourself? There certainly is. And again the career pathways, you need a really good mentor.

I think mentors play such an important part of life in guiding people to the right opportunities. I was very fortunate to have quite a few very good mentors in my life. One of Them being the engineering manager at Ferrybridge of Paul Hook that that really guided my career and pushed me to do more.

Qualifications to Advanced Diploma in Mechanical Engineering. It’s such an exciting time for so many different trades. Yeah.

Whether that be engineering and if I look at my team in particular, we have mechanical engineers, electrical engineers, a lot of civil construction. Yeah. So there’s so many opportunities and with the career paths that are opening up as regards renewables, there’s just so many opportunities for people to really grow.

It was a little bit different through my journey and being 47, it was sort of. The renewables were never really there. It was sort of talked about but weren’t really sure whether they’d come through.

Now traditional career paths, wasn’t it? It was very traditional. Whereas now the new courses that are available through TAFE and future industries and I think this is what AGL is trying to do with the energy hubs concept at Liddell, the Hunter energy hub, the Torrens and the Latrobe Valley is how do we bring in new skills to make the region thrive. And are there any thoughts from an AGL perspective on how we do that? I think we have to recognize the importance that our educational systems play.

Yeah. There’s no question we need the universities to be future forward looking. We need AGL to be communicating what the future technologies could be.

And one very good example to that is the Raygen solar thermal plant which is being really looked at in great details to see how that changes the market. So a solar capturing plant that actually can generate electricity for up to 12 hours. So from a storage, real game changer for us.

Yeah, that’s a huge change. Yeah. So we need the, the other TAFEs and I think one of the challenges that we face as a region is the Hunter is very, very well connected from a mining energy portfolio perspective.

Yeah. There’s going to be new things that are going to come through for both, whether that be pumped hydro, whether it be the wind, the solar. And even with sundrive earlier this year we announced, the Prime Minister announced the sundrive project and that’s fantastic for the region.

Yeah. So I guess as far as Liddell as a site, my understanding opened in 1971, so I think roughly 52 years of operation there on that site, you know, often referred to as, I guess one of the key power stations in the area. Can you share a little bit more about the, the journey of that particular site and what’s taken place there? It really has done a tremendous service to New South Wales and when you Consider traditional coal fired power stations were designed for around that 25 to 30 years.

To hit 52 is really a credit to the people that worked there, led there and again to this day they supported the process of what we’ve done. So as a site we’ve just completed decommissioning so the removal of all the contaminants and the makesafe. We signed a contract with CMA Delta Group to prepare the site for demolition.

So hopefully we’ll be having a few conversations later on in the year around the commencement the major structures. AGL is really committed to making sure that we prepare the site for future use and our goals is the commercial aspect. I think we’ve announced a number of MOUs, whether that be the sun drive projects.

You’ve got battery recycling, solar recycling. There’s so many other avenues that agil’s considering to make the best use of the land available. And I think one of the interesting things you pointed out when we went up for a tour was just I guess Agile’s approach to recycling materials that are part of the old power station as well, I think interesting fact.

Whether it’s true, I hope it is. That I read online was just around how much steel was up there being recycled? I think something like more than was in the Harbour Bridge. Yeah, that’s right.

I mean the first approach we took was around the contaminant removal. So how do we stop a legacy? How do we make sure we recycle? I’m pleased to say that we’ve recycled over 800,000 liters of oil. Wow.

So repurposed, not just disposed, which is really important. It’s a challenge that we set ourselves at the start of decommissioning. How do we make sure that we don’t leave or we leave the least amount of legacy for anybody at a later stage.

So conveyor belt. I think we’ve recycled around 20km of ply conveyor belt and chemicals. We’ve reused chemicals at Bayswater.

I suppose it’s a very fortunate position to have Bayswater just 5km over the road. Yeah, we think there’s around 75, 70 to 75,000 tonnes, which is a little bit more than Sydney Harbour Bridge. Yeah, that will certainly go into other cars, buildings.

So it’s something we are very conscious of and the team should be very proud of the figures that we’ve hit at the moment. Yeah, I think it’s really important because often I guess people paint, you know, a coal fired power station in particular, you know, colour, but it’s really showing how environmentally conscious it can be in a project like this as well. Yeah.

It certainly takes a lot of man hours to get the project into that concept phase. So the team, the engineering team have certainly put a lot of effort into to get the project to where it is. I think it helps when you have a coo, Marcus Brockoff, who is really clear that we don’t leave that legacy.

We are socially responsible. Yeah. And that we give back to the community as well, which is equally as important.

So one of the things of Liddell and we want to leave that legacy, we’ve donated a turbine to Musselbrook Council. So we’ll help Musselbrook put that on display. So when you drive through the Musselbrook, you’ll see the coal carriage, but you’ll also see the impact of power generation within the local community as well.

That’s really cool because I think as you touched on before, like coal fired power stations is very traditional, you know, career path and you know, some of the local people, that’s all they’ve known is AGL and that site. So it has had a massive impact to the local community. Would you be able to comment on how many people transitioned across from Liddell to Bayswater? So Liddell used to employ around 300 people.

Yep. Give or take. The commitment through the EA is that anybody who would like a job retains a job.

So the AGL team members that weren’t retiring or transitioning, they’ve all successfully gained meaningful employment at Bayswater. Again, very fortunate to have Bayswater so close. Yeah.

A number of the teams stayed on to assist with decommissioning. So we had around 25 specialists that helped prepare the site for demolition. But yes, most of the people I’ve been very fortunate to be at Bayswater and I think at Bayswater now, I think we’re employing around about 550.

Yeah. Okay. As in subcontractors now as in AGL staff.

Yeah. Wow. Around that 500 markish.

And currently with the major outage that Mitch and the team are doing, I would imagine there would be at least another 600 people supporting that major outage event. How long’s the outage go for? I think it was an 81 day outage. So quite a big investment.

Over $100 million by the time they’ve completed all the work. So certainly a big commitment to keeping the lights on, I suppose in one particular way and making sure that they’re reliable. And look, they’ve done a fantastic job at Bayswater over the last 12 months.

In making sure that the plant was available. And again, it goes in to support the functions that keep something like that. And again, we think Liddell is quite a big site.

Bayswater and Oriran, et cetera, are significantly bigger. Yeah. Okay.

And I guess as far as closing a power station, that’s a pretty big thing to happen. Not many, I guess power stations are closed in Australia. You know, we’ve got learnings potentially from Wilerawang and other sites.

Could you share some of those learnings or maybe surprises that are even popped up with the closure of the site? I mean this is where we call out a few of the key demolition specialists in likes of Delta, cmi, Liberty Industrial. They really educated us. So it was something that was very new to agl and that thing called Covid got in the way as well.

So it threw a few more challenges in being invited to Explosive events. Demolition events by Delta at Hazelwood, Wilhaira Wang with Liberty. They’re so insightful.

And when you understand the work that goes into a major event is just mind blowing and it’s something that we’re going through the moment. So the engineering, the third party engineering that supports the third party third party engineering that supports. Because they’re very high risk pieces of work.

Yeah. Making sure that things fall, tumble, explode in an orderly fashion, a controlled fashion is something that’s front and center. We were guided heavily by Delta Group through a.

An early contractor involvement. So I think the biggest things to understand is one, what are our key principles? How are we going to do it and what’s the end state? And having those close contact points of view with the demolition specialists. We developed work instructions and quality control sign off documentation which means that we can actually document and provide to the specialist.

This is what we said we’re going to do. This is how we’ve actually done it without those contracting parties advising agl. And I’m sure they do that with many other clients.

The journey is certainly harder. Yeah. And I think often you don’t think about all the planning that goes into a demolition.

We’ve all seen, you know, too many YouTube videos of things just being blown up and falling down. You don’t realize all the steps involved, you know, to have it fall down in a particular way. Yeah.

We’re well four years into planning. Yeah. And our demolition journey is going to start very, very early in 2025.

Yeah. So probably four and a half by then. Just to look at the animations like the way that things are designed to fall on the test ones.

So when you look at the spectrum of trades. There’s computers, there’s graphics, there’s programming, there’s engineering, there’s blasting and explosive use. Yeah.

There’s just such a wonderful array of specialists that come together to make it happen. It’s very similar to the coal fired power station, the first one that was ever built. Yeah.

And I still walk around Liddell thinking how the heck did we put all that together? Yeah. It’s pretty impressive if you look back in time at the timeline. Yeah.

So many brilliant minds have come together to go, hey, we need to put precipitators on the back of flue gas. Two reasons. One, pollution control.

The second reason is that we don’t want the damage to the, to the ID fans. Then the next part, how does the boiler system work effectively and how do we get controls? Because we want the boilers to ramp up in a certain way and then we go to turbines and like making sure that they sink at 50 hertz and things. It’s just so many amazing people that come together to provide something so wonderful.

Yeah. And when is the expected kind of wrap up of the project? Now you’re putting pressure on me. I suppose.

We’d really like to be completed with demolition by very late 2026, early 2027 and then we’ll have a look at what the site looks like. Once we’ve cleared site to where do we do further works. We’re certainly very focused that we have an end goal in mind which is being prepared for its next use.

But I think hopefully we may see some major planned events where the stacks come down in probably August 2025 with the boiler houses coming down late 25, early 26. Yeah. So the fun part of seeing the explosions and hearing the big bangs is something that everybody’s going to probably want to share in.

Cool. So I guess looking at AGL more so in the Hunter region. Now, outside of the assets in the Hunter Valley, you’ve also got the gas plant out at Tomago, if that’s a correct name for it.

Yeah. Newcastle Gas Storage. Yep.

Yeah. Can you share with us I guess a little bit more about AGL in the Hunter region? It’s certainly strong. We’ve got so many amazing, very highly skilled people and the industry certainly needs those individuals.

And again, the innovation that comes in internally, we just announced Bayswater, we did a two shift in run which is really important because we’re not going to be that traditional baseload power station moving forward. Things will change. So the workforce that we have will certainly be involved in some other opportunities on site.

And Travis Hughes, the general manager for Energy Hubs as a whole, certainly sees the value that the Hunter provides. That’s why we have a designated Hunter Energy Hubs team that are looking for those opportunities, whether that be in Newcastle or up in the Upper Hunter at Liddell Bayswater. Yeah.

I think when you’ve got somebody that’s passionate about future technologies, as Travis is, and the skill base that we have, you have to invest and that’s something that we’re looking to invest in from a qualifications point of view. I mean there’s some of my team that are going to be doing a demolition accredited course. Yeah.

There’s the solar that’s coming through, the new solar that’s coming through the high efficiencies, there’s AGL’s commitment for feasibility for Musselbrook Pumped Hydro. Yeah. So I just think there’s too much here to let go.

And when you’re supported by Newcastle University with the qualifications that they do the Musselbrook tafe, the future is certainly bright. Yeah, I think we’re very fortunate with the Newcastle Uni. Obviously they’ve now got renewable energy courses, but certainly quite an engineering hub and also with all the STEM support they supply through to the schools and things like that as well.

So, you know, build up our next generation of people moving into the space. Yeah. And when you look at mining and power generation, certainly if you’re an engineer in the near future, if not now, and you’re going to be in the near future, it’s certainly a thriving trade to be in.

Yeah. Both with looking at how energy grids are expanding, changing so that electrical, mechanical, civil. There’s such an opportunity for those individuals.

Yeah. What’s the pending date for Bayswater to close? Bayswater is looking at 30 to 33 and Latrobe Valley you’re looking at Loyang, which is 2035ish. Okay.

So again there’s going to be lots of opportunity for people that are interested in that decommissioning, demolition, rehabilitation, remediation perspective. And that’s why it’s so nice to be in the Hunter because as our minds are closing there’s environmental roles and currently my team are trying to recruit an environmental advisor. So again there’s always opportunities that are going to present yourselves.

I think the landscape is going to be different but I think there’s a transition to get to where we’re going and that’s the exciting part where people can be really innovative in what the future looks like. Yeah. I Think it’s just having the right mindset for that skills transition piece.

Agree. And you need that enthusiasm. Yeah.

Which our younger colleagues often have in spades. Yeah. And we’ve just got to harness that and give them the opportunities to grow.

But I think from that kind of more senior hiring manager perspective, kind of when you’re planning future planning, your teams looking at, you know, what skills can transition over and maybe some of the micro kind of courses and things like that, people can study. So, yeah, hugely important. Yeah.

If you don’t invest in yourself, it’s very difficult to expect to be given those opportunities. So certainly podcasts. Yeah.

Audio books and the courses that are available at TAFE and unis are hugely important. Yeah. And that’s what big businesses are looking for.

They’re looking for somebody that’s got some drive and really wants to demonstrate their value. And if you can do that, then the doors will open and open very wide. Earlier in the conversation, we were chatting about, I guess, relocating to Australia.

Why did you choose Australia as a place to relocate to? I didn’t really. It wasn’t something that we were looking to do to come to Australia. I knew the power station that I was working at, Ferrybridge, was heading towards closure and I had secured another role at another power station as a manager there.

And out of the blue, a phone call came and said, hey, have I got the opportunity of a lifestyle for you, life for you? And I sort of dismissed it and said, ah, yeah, okay, mate, yeah, no, I’m not interested. Six months later, we moved to Western Australia, to Mujer Power Station. Again, it just happened so quickly.

I’m so thankful, looking back, that it was a tremendous move, challenging move, and very thankful for FaceTime and all the other apps that support keeping in touch with family. So 11 years in January this year. I think it’s a place for opportunities Australia.

My children are so thankful for the opportunity that they’ve been provided. And my youngest daughter’s a mechanical fitter at Bayswater Power Station. So it’s amazing how opportunities come to light.

She’s very focused on her trade and again, that’s only capable to be done by the commitment to Musselbrook TAFE and the skills program. And I think she’s also done a cert 4 and diploma in pneumatics hydraulics through the TAFEs as well. So I’m very, very fortunate to live in the.

In the place that we do. Yeah. With the opportunities that arise.

But again, it really wasn’t the dream. It’s a dream that I’ve become to really class as home. And in April this year we did citizenship.

So it’s certainly something that we’re not going to leave and go back to the uk. Yeah. Is the energy industry that different here to the uk? If you look back in the UK now, the last coal fired power station close closed around a week ago.

So the UK has been gradually removing the coal fired industry. Very heavy in gas, very heavy in renewables, which is great in the renewable space. UK is not one of the places that solar really is beneficial, so it’s not one of the things that they do look to use.

They are investing in other technologies, which is great. Australia is on the transition and we have some of the best resources available. Yeah, we have the sun that shines predominantly 300 days of the year instead of the UK where it shines probably 65 days a year.

Yeah. The wind, the offshore wind is something that we can harness here very well. So very different in markets.

Yeah. Okay. The coal will close, there’s no question.

It’s just got to be at the right time once we’ve done the right transition. Yeah. And what do you think the market might look like in say, 10, 15 years time? I hope it’s a very green in that 10, 15 years time.

I certainly want the legacy to be a better environment for future generations. And look, coal fired stations are doing a lot to remove emissions and to be greener. They’ve come a long way from where we started back in 1970 and 1980s.

But longer term we have to change. There’s no shifting away from that. AGL is very focused.

That’s why we set a very ambitious target of 12 gigawatts of renewables. And it’s something that Damien is very passionate about and Marcus too. Where are you sitting at in that space at the moment with renewables? I think we just added around about 2 gigawatts this year.

Again, it’s a big target. Lidel battery has commenced construction. So yeah, hopefully within the next 18 months Liddell Battery will be operational.

I think Marcus will require it being operational before there, but as its full capacity around about 18 months, which just help firm up the grid a little bit. Yeah, we’ve got Musselbrook Pumped Hydro, which is certainly going through feasibility and other partners are doing their bit as well. I think there’s a great opportunity.

Yeah. And for the tech nerds out there, what type of batteries are you using up at Liddell? Square ones. That’s not, it’s not something I’m really that Involved in.

Yeah. I certainly help clear the space that makes it available for it to happen. Yeah.

But I’m sure we can get some other information for you. Yeah, that’s okay. Thank you.

So I guess around the closure of Liddell, is there anything unexpected to come out of that site or from the closure of the site? I should say, I think planning and approvals is something that we underestimated on time. Making sure that we’re compliant to the requirements of site, whether that be from an environmental perspective, but making sure that you. Adequate timeframes.

I think we’ve been going around about three years and hopefully we’re around about six months from finalizing all those planning approvals. Wow. It’s a long process.

It is a long process. There’s a lot of information, a lot of assessments that go into that. Certainly making sure that we don’t damage any of the habitats.

We’re very conscious of our footprint and trying to keep things fairly limited to only disturbing areas that we’ve disturbed previously. I suppose that’s one of the key things. The other one is, and the engineers amongst us will certainly understand this, we have lots of amazing drawings.

Let’s just say that not all of the drawings are up to date. And certainly as we’re doing some assessments and looking at contamination, ground attack contamination, and we’re doing the infield service inspections of going. Yes, we should be clear.

We’re doing the ground penetration surveys to go, there’s nothing underneath. And then once we actually drill, we hit a drain. So let’s just say not all the services have gone exactly where we thought they were.

Yeah. Which has certainly created a few challenges and it’s certainly easier now the station’s closed to do some of that work. But from a live plant, which we did quite a lot of surveys pre closure.

Yeah. And we’re. Oh, there’s a drain there.

There’s not supposed to be a drain there. Yeah. It’s certainly been an eye opener.

So I think they’re the real key things that we’ve found. Some of this. The structural supports are a little bit thicker than the drain actually suggests as well.

So certainly makes the challenge a little bit harder for the demolition specialists. The stacks are a little bit thicker in the concrete, so to say you need them pretty thick. It’s.

Until you see it, you don’t understand how much concrete goes into, you know, sit under turbines and things like that in a power station. Yeah, absolutely. We anticipate around 200,000 tons of concrete in Liddell.

Wow. So from Liddell As a brand new power station, there was around 100,000 tons of steel. Obviously these wear and tear.

Yeah. We did a retrofit from precipitators to bag filters for emission control. So we’ve removed a little bit more.

So there’s quite a lot of material there. Yeah. Which we’re hoping to hit a 95 to 98% recycle rate.

That’s really impressive. So the concrete we’ll try and use on site, the steel will certainly be reprocessed. Yeah.

So bold figures. We’re aiming high and we think we’re going to hit most of those. Yeah.

And I guess there’s like a cost effective side of recycling and reusing products as well. Yeah. It certainly offsets the cost of demolition.

I mean these projects are not small dollars, they’re in the tens of millions and even in the hundreds of millions. So being efficient but also making sure that legacy doesn’t carry on over to somebody else. Yeah.

So we’re very focused on that. Steel at the moment is very up and down for the ferrous and non ferrous. Yeah.

And it’s something that we watch on a. On a regular basis. The good thing for us is we actually need the concretes, the cost of concrete.

We need that for the general site arrangement. So the safe, stable, non polluting site is what we’re chasing, ready for its future development. And that concrete will give us a huge help.

Head start. I suppose. Yeah.

And I guess as far as obviously the site next to it where the battery is taking place, but the site itself that you’re working on. Do you know what the future plan might be yet or is that something you’re allowed to discuss? We don’t know at this moment in time. I think we’ve got quite a number of pluses.

Yeah. One, we’ve got a grid connection there with very big capabilities. Yeah.

So we all know that lidl was a 500 megawatt units, so we know we’ve got some big supplies. We have 33kV general works power. So we’re in a fortunate position.

We have water connections. Ideally we’d really like that big energy draw. That’s what it’s designed for.

But yeah, again, when you look at sundrive and what, what the power requirements are there, there’s some great opportunities. There’s over 10, 000 hectares of land. Yeah.

So we’re not short on space. Yeah. But we’ve got to make sure that we put things in the right places to really complement each other.

Yep. And that’s the natural habitat of some of the amazing species that we have and plant life that we have around Liddell. Yeah.

And obviously we’ve got a very nice lake which our facilities overlook at the moment. So it’s like lakeside views. It’s like the perfect office.

Yeah. Never thought someone selling a power station as being lakeside views before. Yeah.

It’s very calming at the moment. There’s quite a difference in a running site. I mean, to hear silence.

I know when we. We did the tour, it’s very dark at the moment. The plant now we turned all the power off.

It’s very eerie. I was supposed to say it was quite eerie almost. Yeah.

I don’t know. You could feel the history within the building. Yeah.

Even though there wasn’t the humming of the machines and it was a bit of a creak and a moan. Yeah. Again, it’s back to the people that have maintained Liddell, operated Liddell, provided all that support.

And that’s not just agl, that’s lots of our third party contractors that have done so much as well to have a demolition specialist come to site and say this is a fantastic site and there’s not a lot we have to do to make things safe to be able to demolish. And some of the other sites we do know have had issues. Again, it’s a credit to the people that have looked after Liddell.

Yeah. As far as, I guess if you’re looking back at your own career, young James entering the workforce, would you have advice to younger people entering the industry? Yes. Study hard.

I think it is one of the things I. I studied later in life. It’s certainly easier when you’re in the mode of learning.

Yeah. So would I changed the career path? Yes, I probably would have done. I would have certainly gone for my full degree and I would have certainly tagged on some structural elements to that.

Yeah. It is super interesting now going through the designs and the demolition methodologies. So looking at the FEA analysis type stuff and to look at how we’re gonna the bending moments to actually bring the columns down.

And I think he’s super interesting and to have more insight into that would have been really beneficial. But again, I’m super thankful for SSE for investing in and pushing me to do an advanced diploma in mechanical engineering. I don’t really get the electrical part.

I struggle to see the electrical part. My dad’s an electrical engineer. Yeah.

Okay. Is there a bit of a competitiveness there between the streams? So my dad always believes that the first people picked out of an Engineering pool is electrical and then somewhere along the outer rims there’s the mechanical ones. I don’t believe in that, but it’s nice to have that argument.

And obviously, I guess, sounds like you’re the next generation in your family’s taking up the industry as well with your daughter doing a mechanical trade. Yeah, I think she’ll go a little bit further as well. I think she wants to study more.

She really needs to embed that trade. She’s only six months out of her apprenticeship. A few years, you never know where it’ll lead to.

Again, I’d encourage her that that advanced diploma is a sort of a minimum level to go to. But again, she’ll figure that one out herself. She’s very strong, opinionated, so I’m sure she’ll do fine.

Yeah. But I think it’s good for people coming in the industry. Like, you know, you don’t have to do the degree straight away.

You can start with a trade and then move your way through. I think some of the best engineers actually do so much better by having that hands on approach. They become like tremendous in field engineers.

Yeah. Because not only can they understand the concept of it, they actually understand the pros and cons of taking everything apart and putting things back together. So they gain so much more insight.

We have some tremendous infield engineers. Yeah. And I believe I have one of the best in Tom Abrahams that’s within my team.

Very practical. He’s worked at Liddell now for over 10 years. I don’t think there’s an item of plant that Tom hasn’t had in pieces and guided trades to help put back together.

But the fact that he’s wanted to be there and see the whole process means that he’s a very good engineer at the other side of that. Okay, so again, Tom Abraham’s tremendous engineer and one that’s come from a maritime background. Yeah.

Okay. So it’s not the traditional coal fired power station. These other industries that do feed in.

I think all heavy industry has some degree of overlap. Yeah. And again, I think a lot has to do with attitude and how you can adapt.

Yeah, Adaptability is really important. Again, that willingness to learn, try new things and. Yeah, look, we make mistakes.

Nobody’s perfect. Yeah. We just make mistakes at an early stage rather than a late stage.

Yeah. But I think once again you’re having the team around you willing to support that transition as someone switching industries. Yeah.

I mean the site transition team is around. I think we’ve got 17 people in our Liddell Transition team looking at all aspects of the closure. So obviously we’ve got a nice disposal facility that we close in.

So there’s a civil project management team, there’s civil engineers, civil supervisors, so there’s quite a difference. And then the power station block, we’ve got the closure manager of Chris and that closure support team that look at the engineering components and then we have a planning approval and environment team, which are probably the most important team really because we are very focused, we are very mindful and being guided by that team is, is really important. Yeah, I think that’s been a clear message through our chat today around the environmental impact and how socially conscious you guys are of that.

So it’s really nice to hear. Otherwise, I guess you, outside of, you know, working in a power station, what else do you do when you’re not at work? As far as, you know, a bit of stress relief or, you know, how do we, how do we get to know you a little bit better? If I talk to my predecessor. Australia days, I was a professional rugby league player.

Yeah. With Castleford and Featherstone from, I’m going to say 94 to 2005. Outside work.

Nowadays, I like to see Australia. For the last four or five years we’ve been traveling Australia and with our caravan, so. And I head off in a couple of weeks time for seven weeks across Australia to Western Australia again.

So I think Australia’s got so many different qualities to show and I have a little scratch map. So of all the places that we go and I think I’ve scratched off around about 1% so I have a heck of a lot to go and see. But yeah, certainly travel is one of the big things and obviously my wife and two children as well take a bit of time.

Must be a good experience in doing it all in a van. It is. You certainly know your boundaries of living in a 19 foot box.

Yeah, you certainly know your limitations of how far you, you’re willing to go each day and travel and what you want to see. I think the one thing that makes it so important and so nice is the people that you meet along the way. Yeah.

And they’re so willing to share. Have you been to this place? You should really consider. So I think we’ve got trips planned now for the next seven years of advice.

Where people have gone, oh, you really need to go to there. Oh, you need to get to the Northern Territory. You need to go to Kakadu National Park.

There’s just so many places that we go. We’re going to get There. Yeah.

We may have to demolish a power station in between, but ultimately we’ll get there. Yeah. So do you do an annual trip with the family? My daughters are a little bit older now of 23 and 21, so they certainly don’t want to be traveling with mum and dad.

Yeah. So it’s just me and my wife at the moment. Believe it or not.

We’re all catching up in Bunbury, Western Australia for a week. Yeah. Where we’ll all be together for one week because my eldest daughter lives in WA still.

Okay. And my youngest daughter lives in musselbrook. So.

Yeah. 4,200 kilometers apart. So to get them together in one place is pretty special.

Yeah. So we’ll make the most of that one week before heading off in different directions again. Yeah.

That’s awesome. Love it. Yeah, it has its challenges.

It would. Having two strong willed daughters I think would have its challenges in itself. It does.

And now I’m a pop, so again, a little three year old I think will be running the legs off me, but hopefully we’ll learn him how to fish. Yeah, we do like a little bit of fishing and try and catch our tea while we’re away. So we’ll see how we go.

Awesome. Well, thanks so much for sharing, I guess your story with us. Is there anything that we haven’t covered off that you’d like to share? The biggest thing I have to say is I’m so fortunate.

I’m fortunate that I was guided by some very inspirational people. My dad being one in starting his own business. Paul Hook.

Unfortunate for the experience to arrive in Australia. Yeah, I think I’m more fortunate to be in the position that I’m doing now. And with AGL and embarking on our first major closure, I feel very fortunate every day and very thankful to the powers that make that happen again.

There’s a lot of hard work that goes in behind the scenes to. To one be in a position where I’m trained and competent to be able to do the work. But also listen to lots of different types of leadership and podcasts and audio books that help cement, I hope a very happy team and a very successful project.

Yeah, it’d be such a milestone to be involved with. Yeah, it certainly is. And a stepping stone, hopefully for Bayswater.

I’m excited to see the next chapter and what happens up there. It’s going to be a different landscape. Awesome.

Well, yeah, once again, thank you so much for your time. No, thank you very much for having me. You’re welcome.